Experience bails out youth as Arsenal edge Bolton 2-1

Jamie Sanderson October 26, 2011 Matches 69 Comments

After admitting he’s still haunted by the result of Arsenal’s last Carling Cup run, Arsène Wenger watched his side continue their passage through this years competition, after edging Bolton 2-1 at the Emirates.

Ozyakup

In a tournament that Wenger still regards as some what of a play ground for young talent, it required his experienced heads to help guide the Gunners into the last eight, for the ninth consecutive time. As I wrote last night, Łukasz Fabiański, Thomas Vermaelen, Sébastien Squillaci, Yossi Benayoun, Andrey Arshavin and Park Chu-Young all started, and all proved their worth, against a Bolton side who were difficult to kill off.

Nico Yennaris slotted in at right back, and despite some early nerves, looked assured, composed and his usual aggressive self, turning in an almost faultless performance. The same couldn’t have been said for third round stars Francis Coquelin and Emmanuel Frimpong, who were only good in patches, and were at the heart of a mix up which saw Fabrice Muamba thump home the opener.

Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain, Man of the Match against Shrewsbury, turned in a notably poor performance, so it was left to Arshavin and the always dangerous Chu-Young, to grab the goals to win the tie. At the other end, Vermaelen was the pick of a solid defensive display, while Miquel seemed comfortable at left back, but was rarely directly troubled.

After the experience had turned around the scoreline, Wenger handed another début out, this time to defender Danny Boateng, while Ryo Miyaichi and Oğuzhan Özyakup also joined the party. The latter two showed drive, energy and some glorious touches going forward, but tempered that with good tracking back and defending.

So, a place in the quarter finals. Arsenal will now almost certainly look to get all of tonight’s bench out on loan, with a more experienced focus set to come back for the latter stages.

Still, it’s been fun, and an introduction for many prospects. Now, they must prove they deserve more chances.

69 Comments

  • which players will Wenger be looking to send out on loan? hopefully Ozyakup and Ryo as their two that i really want to see challenge for first team spots next season. Solid win all the same agaisnt a strong Bolton side – GUNNERS :)

  • Dont forget this was a strong Bolton line up for the more inexperienced players like Ox-Cham, frimpong and Coq to come up against. Our first team only beat a very similar bolton line up 3-0 and they faced 10 men for almost the full second half. great result i think.

  • I just don’t want us to push it. Only play the top young talents that actually have a chance here. No more Eastmonds please. Well done though on the win.

  • I could write a whole buisness plan on the HUGE commercial potential that Arsenal are missing out on here in Asia. The club could grow its fanbase exponentially and really compete with Man Ure with the right strategy.

    But the great thing from tonight is that we had A Korean and a Japanese playing together at one point; and they’re both fantastic players!

    • Thats why Kagawa and Nagatomo would have been the first players I would have been after or even Honda. Japan actually has the quality to go with the marketing now.

  • Yennaris didn’t put a foot wrong. I don’t recall a missed tackle or misplaced pass. Very encouraging debut, in fact one of the best i’ve seen from a young Arsenal debutant.
    But i still prefer him in midfield all the same.

  • As for Ryo, he really gets you out of your seat. And he gets stuck in, as he did when he outfought a Bolton player before going off on one of his buccaneering runs at goal.
    Also thought that Ozyakup again looked neat and tidy and used the ball intelligently.

  • Looked good but of all mentioned I only see ryo, pong, la cock staying. All the rest on loan but that is not bad a+++++

  • arsenal still need to buy a couple of young right backs for the youth system. behind sagna and jenkinson it’s all kids playing there out of position, no naturals, and that’ll never work.

    • A lot of top full backs are actually converted from midfielders. Usually wingers with athleticism, pace and not enough quality to be a top winger but enough to be very good attacking full backs.

    • JS, apparently Vermaelen’s new contract broke the previous wage structure? Are the board looking to change the wage structure?

      IMO that’s the only way we can ensure situations like Nasri’s don’t happen too often.

  • I couldn’t be more happier with the young guns, especially Yennaris. Having followed Ryo’s development last year at Feyenoord, I’m not that surprised he can get fans off their seat. Since he has joined us he has just been unlucky with injury. I also think Ozyakup has a bright future. Having watched him play for the reserve in several occasions, he is really good with the ball and can make some exquisite passes. He just needs to go out on loan and get some game time; preferably to a premier league team. The future is certainly bright!

  • Ryo really has won most of the fans hasn’t he? the crowd was mental everytime he did something.

    As for Coquelin, well he sadly had a poor game as Ox, but it makes me question if Coq-Frimpong is a good combo in midifield, is just one game though, and we won :)

  • Like to see Watt and Qzyakup go to a struggling PL side could be instant impact for them. Freeman a championship loan would be great too! Cheers!

  • WHy do they need to buy rightbacks? i thougt Yennaris was very good indeed. A couple more yeas and he can turn in to be a veyr good player.

  • How was Coquelin and Frimpong????

  • Coquelin vs Frimpong vs Yennaris vs Lansbury for defensive midfield in a couple of seasons? Who do people rate the highest?

  • Out of that lot, it’s obviously Lansbury who’s been the best. But he’s not really a defensive midfielder as such. He’s a box-to-box player; much like Ray Parlour. So it’d be wrong to categorize him in the same league as Coquelin, Frimpong, and Yennaris.

  • Gunner from the south

    i don’t agree that coquelin, frimpong and AOC were poor… aoc didn’t have the best of games, but didn’t give up runing back when needed like arshavin and theo do when they have a bad game… he had some good runs, won a couple balls with pressure, won some free kicks… sure he wasn’t at his best on some 1 on 1′s with the bolton defenders, but he is still young and this was a strong bolton team… frimpong and coquelin didn’t shine in defense like they usually do, but were solid in passing and well had a bit quiet game, but were all in all solid, against almost the strongest bolton team… and you were spot on about yennaris in your article… not super talented, but a lion, never gives up, smart in the air, physically good for his age, and can play and cover a number of positions… squilachi had in my opinion an ok game, looks better when TV… i’m happy with this match cos some if not all of these youngsters showed that they can come in when needed and are ready…

  • if we are talking about the same game i saw…. i saw yennaris lack of tracking back contributed highly to the first goal. after muamba took the ball and passed to klasnic, yennaris just jogged back and watch klasnic advance and lay off the pass. He is good as a defender one or one but he hasnt quite grasped the team concept of defending as he repeated his offence again twice. Overall pretty good effort from the lad. He has the right spirit, technique and aggression, even though he played out of position and it was his first time he showed a lot of maturity. Squillaci…. i hope what wenger saw in him to buy him comes back, he just looks like he wants to do something but cant get out of his own way. Vermaelen did great, however, he is very guilty of constantly over comitting on the tackle and almost got burned by Klasnic. I think if he comes back he cannot pair with Mertesacker because his overcomitting style of defending which is opportunistic and aggressive although good i dont think would work with Mert’s lack of speed. Just a thought. Miquel, played ok, didnt do anything to help offensively but was solid defensively. He was terribly gassed in the last 20 minutes and his lack of speed was starting to show as bolton attacked the weakness. Frimpong and Coq i dont think work together as a tandem unless we are intending to play brutish football. Frimpong has regressed as far as im concerned. Hardly looks the part of a first teamer if you ask me. A lot of poorly thought out decision. He better get his head in the game there is quite a lot of talent behind him in that position. Coq love his tenacity and he is quite a passer. I see him as the closest in mold to Song. Benayoun had an average game with a few flashes, but i like what i see. AOC, should have scored early in the game but it’s ok further proof that his game needs sharpening people. Let the coach… coach! for lack of better words. Arshavin should be played at his preferred position, i think he showed us why. That pass to park…. lovely. PARK!!!

  • SORRY ABOUT THE GRAMMAR JUST WOKE UP…. Park… rusty but very energetic and i loved his movement, wasnt scared to shoot and scored a beauty. I want to see more to believe. Like what i see so far.

  • Shahriar Norouzi

    Why doesn’t Chuks Aneke get any time? You hear so much about his talent but he never plays.

    • for the moment he has plenty of player in front of him first team , back up player ,and young player with more experience than him.

      he has to be patient and work hard

  • @gunnerfromthesouth
    I agree with most of ur analysis about the match. We played good good soccer but we can do better. However i beg to differ with frimpong. Please go back and watch him in midfield. He is an outstanding physical specimen but that passing and decision making even with fouls and stuff has to improve because it would cost us. I’ve been on record of saying that yes his aggression is much similar to vieira’s but arsenal at this point in time have much to lose and we cant afford him the same laxity we afforded vieira to grow out of it. I think they need to talk to him about it consistently because he is a talented player but a keg of powder waiting to explode on our side of the battle line. Great kid, just needs to make better judgement. I thought AOC and Coq were just dandy as you eluded in your posting. Cheers.

  • Pure and utter stupidity to expect Vermaelen to play 90 minutes in his first game back for ages. I can’t believe we’ve done that. He was always going to get injured. I assume he’ll now miss the Chelsea game. Ryo was quality when he came on. The guy has so much natural ability, outstanding pace and great heart. Can’t wait to see more of him.

    @YoungGunsBlog
    Jamie Sanderson
    Chants of ‘Ryo, Ryo, Ryo’ as he skins Steinsson. Japanese winger has lit up closing stages.

    Love that kid.

  • Verm didn’t play 90 minutes and is not injured it was just a little calf cramp. The club have announced he is fit for Saturday against the chavs but I do not think le boss will break up the excellent Kos and Mert partnership. He may play elsewhere though so expect a surprise!

    • Well he played 84 and had to come off. There’s surely no way he’s gonna start on Saturday whereas if we’d given him say 45 minutes maybe he could have.

      Kos–Merte–Vermaelen–Santos/Gibbs

      Would’ve been ideal. Really don’t trust Djourou at centre back anymore let alone right back.

  • Arshavin should play behind the striker

    • It’s clearly his best position. He’s not a left winger, he’s 10x better playing centrally. I don’t know if it would work in the tough games though, I don’t think he’s got the discipline to make it midfield 3 in the centre when we don’t have the ball. But definitely against the weaker teams at home where we struggle for creativity:

      ————Song—–Arteta
      Chamberlain—–Arshavin—-Gervinho
      —————–RvP

      Something like that.

  • Watched about 75 minutes of the games last night.

    Must say, AOC looked a lot like Walcott last night in the fact that he was so random and panicked on the ball, but I believe that was just because we did not pick him even when he was playing great so he felt he really had to show out.

    I also think people are over doing this Yennaris thing. I mean he was ok, but as a full back, you can not be judged until you come up against proper wingers. His best thing was definitely his defensive positioning.

    I agree that Park looks like he would be great with players with vision. He seems could at finding pockets of space and looks a good finisher.

    Miguel got abused, no other way of putting it. If Gael Kakuta had more quality after getting by him then we would have lost by 2 or 3.

    The 2 centerbacks did well for the most part. Great to see Vermaelen back.

    Coquelin and Frimpong just looked off the pace. They wanted far to much time on the ball but I believe that with the starters, that would not happen because they move of the ball better.

    Overall considering the line up, a great win. Well done Arsenal.

  • Coquelin’s movement when we have the ball worries me – too often he just seems to be jogging around instead of moving like he needs to in order to open up another passing option.

    Ozyakup was brilliant in the few minutes he played – I can see why people have been raving about him.

    Miquel looked reasonably solid defensively, but is obviously not much of a full-back offensively.

    I also thought O-C didn’t have a bad game. Not a great one, but not a terrible one either.

    Who else played from the youngsters? Oh, Yennaris, of course – tidy enough, hardly a top-quality right-back just now, though. And Ryo showed both why it’s obvious he has lots of talent, and why he’s not quite ready for the first-team yet.

    • The first one is an issue with the team in general and especially the young players and one of the biggest things (other than Messi) that separated us from Barcelona in recent years. They are always showing for them ball and making themselves options to receive the pass, where as we do not unless it is in the attacking 3rd. I pointed this out about Jack Wilshere last year.

  • I didn’t get to see the match…I got to see Man U against Aldershot instead, lucky me…I don’t know what we will do with Vermaelen now that he is fit again. Do you want to risk breaking up a burgeoning partnership between Mertesacker and Koscielny??? Or do you keep those two together for now and wait until one gets injured or loses form??? When fully fit I thought that last year, against Barcelona, both Koscielny and Vermaelen were majestic. But against teams like Stoke, who play it in the air as opposed to on the ground, they would be more challenged. You simple cannot bench your vice-captain when he is healthy. I just don’t know who should play…does anyone??? I bet when Oxlaid Chamberlain gets a true run in the squad and plays he’ll show his best form…it doesn’t take a genius to figure that one out. If Ryo played like he did for Feyenoord and NOT like he did in pre-season, then we have a true left winger on our hands. I wouldn’t compare Ryo and Chamberlain either…from what I have seen they are a bit different to each other.

    • Simple, I would choose Vermaelen and anyone over not having Vermaelen. I am not sure what to make of Mertsacker. He seems to be good at intercepting the ball but what is weird is, that he is poor in the air for a big guy. Personally my choice would be Koscielny and Vermaelen.

      Yes, Ryo and AOC are different types of players. Ryo is that natural tricky winger with pace while AOC is more in that Modric attacking mid with good ball control and good in tight space. The thing that could put AOC on a different level is that he also has the bags of pace.

  • if you want arshavin to perform again like this please leave him on the bench next game then start him against marseille.
    thats my opinion anyway, he’s a game a week player if we start him against chelsea could be disaster

    • Arshavin will always be at his best when given the free role. We are never going to see the old Arshavin of his prime, but like Benyoun, verse lesser teams, he can be creative.

  • Yeah I think we should go with Koscielny and Vermaelen too, now that I really think about it. What I really would like to see is how Chamberlain would play in the middle!!! He’d get to see the ball more and then we’d get to see how he does in a more prominent role. Obviously, it would have to be against weaker opposition, but it would be really interesting to see how he would do.

    • Nah I don’t see any reason why Chamberlain should play anywhere other than wide right, he’s quality there. I know he’s said he likes to play in the centre but he’s far more suited to a wide role. And his passing, vision, awareness etc are decent but not good enough to play centre mid for Arsenal.

    • Disagree, he is a central player. His pace is what makes him excel out wide, but you can tell he has that Modric about him. Regardless, I just want to see him start playing with the first team.

  • Well he’ll have to get used to playing out wide first before he comes in to the middle, but how do you know that he doesn’t have the passing or vision to play there??? Obviously he hasn’t done it yet, but Wenger has said that he sees Walcott and Oxlade Chamberlain as having the capabilities to play in the middle of the park at their respective positions. Until I see more of Chamberlain I won’t be able to make a judgement on his awareness, vision and passing capabilities. Give him a chance before you pigeon-hole him or say that he cannot play a certain style or position. Weren’t you the one who said we should buy Cahill, and now we have a selection headache at centre back??? I’ve seen his last few matches and Cahill has been pretty bad. Maybe it’s because he didn’t go to us, I don’t know, but you aren’t always right. Neither am I, but I try not to jump to conclusions until I have seen enough of the player to judge for myself. I mean truthfully, do you think you have seen enough of Chamberlain to come to that conclusion??? Against Man United last year in the FA Cup, he played more centrally and looked better than anything United had going in their midfield.

    • I am always right Milo lol…jk. I have seen enough of AOC to pass judgement. Quality is quality and usually not that hard to see. In this last game, he did not look relaxed. He looked way to eager to show what he’s got and to me it was because even after good performances, he was not even on the bench. Just let the kid play and he will come through. I mean has Walcott even had 1 good game yet this season?

  • Shane>

    Completely disagree with you about O-C – it’s too soon to say anything worth saying. From what I’ve seen, though, it’s not impossible to imagine him in a few years’ time playing behind a central striker – mazy dribbles and poked through-balls, rather than Bergkamp-style, though.

    • You tend to disagree with me so not surprised lol. Who said anything about Bergkamp style?

  • I should add to my post above “yet”. By all means he could play centrally for us in the future but at the moment clearly AOC is more suited to a wide role. And if its not broke why change it? He’s been superb wide right bar the one game on tuesday, no need to move him around. At the moment his passing, vision and awareness are not good enough to play centre mid at the top level, you’re kidding yourself if you think it is. Maybe in the future but not yet.

    Yes I was the one who said we should have signed Cahill and we should have. How much have you really seen of Bolton? It’s funny you should say how bad he’s been because he’s probably been their best player in an exceptionally poor side. Not to mention that he’s slotted in seamlessly as 1st choice for England alongside Terry, as I said he would in the interim period between Terry/Rio moving on and Jones/Smalling coming in.

    Mertesacker is getting better for us but he’s still struggling with the pace in England and has been a bit hit and miss. Koscielny has had some exceptional games but it’s no coincidence that most of his best ones have come in Europe where it’s less physical, he didn’t look too clever against Stoke for example, and neither did Mersteacker. Vermaelen’s been injured and Djourou has gone from good last season to be completely hopeless this. I’d still sign Cahill. As soon as January the 1st hits I’d be signing Cahill for £7ish million and sending Djourou out on loan. We’d be in a great postion then with four good centre backs to choose from.

    • They didn’t look clever verse Stoke? Stoke was held to 1 shot on goal. Cahill has been awful at Bolton this year. Don’t know what you have been watching.

  • Shane>

    Big difference between Bergkamp levels of style, and merely being a player who plays in a similar way – that is, using vision to craft out chances with great passes. I meant the latter, and in any case was saying that it’s not how I see O-C :)

    The point I was trying to make is that people here are talking about Oxlade-Chamberlain like he’s a contender for a central midfield berth alongside Song, but that’s not what’s meant by him eventually playing centrally. Rather, he’ll be sitting just behind the striker the way Bergkamp used to. From the little we’ve seen of him so far, I don’t think he has vision like Bergkamp, or even just Fabregas, but he does have good quick feet. I can see him in a few years’ time being very successful by beating a couple of defenders with the ball at his feet in order to leave himself a relatively simple pass.

    • Who said him play anything like Bergkamp? People are not saying he should play next to Song. People are talking about him playing in the whole behind the striker which he would be perfect for. Just because you play the same position does not mean you play the same style. Know, he would not play like Bergkamp. He would play more like Hleb, but with better speed and finishing. He would be the guy that does a 1, 2 pass with RVP then beats the last guy on the dribble or gets in behind the defense from the 1,2. He has the similar style to your Nasri’s in the he has very good ball control in tight space, is very agile, has a quick turn of pace, can finish, could in the link up play, can find space and finish and that is just amongst other things. Look, I do not ever over do my judgement. I believed that Szczesny and Wilshere were going to be world class from the first time I saw them and I am bringing it back out for AOC. The kid just looks special and will only get better.

  • “As soon as January the 1st hits I’d be signing Cahill for £7ish million ”

    With six months left on his contract? Bolton would be lucky to get offered much more than £2-3 million for him by anyone except ‘Arry, and insane to take it if they’re involved in a relegation battle.

    The fact is that Cahill’s a £10-12 million rated player normally, but at the moment his value has been slashed because his contract is almost up. It would be wasteful to pay anything approaching full price.

    Anyway, if we need a centre back to come in and be nowhere near good enough for Arsenal, we still have Squillaci in the squad.

  • Cahill no where near good enough lol. 1st choice for England but yeah, he’s as bad as Squillaci, ok.

    And Shane you’ve watched a lot of Bolton this season have you? To come to such a definite conclusion. Been streaming all their games I assume? You didn’t even watch Bolton against us. I don’t pretend to have watched him a lot this season (apart from the England games where he’s been class) but I’ve seen a couple of Bolton games and I go on football forums that have Bolton fans and they say he’s been one of the best performers in an incredibly poor side.

    • If you read the comments, I said I did watch the game and gave my opinion on it. Unfortunately the Carling Cup games are not shown here and there were no streams online that I could find so I had to wait until it was put up on this site I use to watch it. Yes, I watch a lot of Bolton because I like how they play (generally) plus I am a Stuart Holden fan. I watch a whole lot of Prem games (amongst others). Really the only teams I don’t watch are Stoke, Norwich, and westbrom from the prem.

  • Firstly, Cahill’s not first-choice for England. More importantly, even if he were, that wouldn’t necessarily mean he was good enough for Arsenal. This current England side is full of mediocrity.

  • Well he is isn’t he? Rio is always injured and past his best now. Cahill and Terry are first choice. And if there’s one area England are strong it’s centre back. So yeah if he’s good enough for England he’s absolutely without a shadow of a doubt good enough for us. We are poor defensively. Even the most biased Arsenal fan should be able to admit that.

    • Who is his competition for center back if Ferdinand is out? How can you call England good at center back when in the last world cup they took a guy who can not even practice much less play a whole world cup and Mathew Upson. Hardly that great and as I believe you or someone else mentioned, there is just a gap until Smalling and Jones are ready.

      I am still npt saying he is a bad player but just not worth his high fee in my opinion. Also this year when Koscielny and Vermaelen were fit together, look like a great tandem.

  • Shane>

    “Just because you play the same position does not mean you play the same style. Know, he would not play like Bergkamp. He would play more like Hleb”

    Yeah, that was my point. Except I didn’t want to say Hleb, because he was actually incredibly under-rated in terms of his vision and passing ability.

    Adam>

    You can argue the toss about whether Cahill is first-choice or not, but the obvious fact is that he’s only in contention because England don’t have two world-class centre-backs. England aren’t very good at the moment. You might as well suggest that just because Cahill’s been pretty decent for a mid-table side that he’s good enough for Arsenal. No wait, that’s what you’re doing…

  • Shane, England are strong at centre back. Rio and Terry are world class, as much as it pains me to say it Michael Dawson is a superb centre back, Phil Jagielka is a good defender, Ledley King if it wasn’t for his injuries would be one of the best in Europe, Phil Jones is absolutely outstanding for his age and so is Chris Smalling tbh both excellent centre backs already, the much maligned Lescott has actually been excellent for the last year and a bit for City. Good defenders like Roger Johnson and Scott Dann don’t even get near the squad. So yeah if there’s one area England are strong it’s probably centre back.

    Dave, Cahill has been properly excellent in the premier league for the last few years and slotted in seamlessly at International level, not looking out of place in the slightest. He’s CLEARLY more than good enough for us. He’d be an improvement on every one of our centre backs bar Vermaelen. We are crap defensively. That’s the sad fact of the matter. You make it sound like we are late 80′s Milan defensively and only the very best is good enough for us. Cahill is just a very good and reliable all round centre half. Simple as. And he’s available for cheap.

    “You can argue the toss about whether Cahill is first-choice or not, but the obvious fact is that he’s only in contention because England don’t have two world-class centre-backs.”
    You could say the same for Mertesacker. Cahill has without doubt faced better competition than Mertesacker has in racking up the caps for Germany.

    • Cahill is facing better competition the Mertsacker for Germany? Are you kidding me? That is the problem in england. English players are over rated and you think just because those are the players you watch then they are big names.

  • “Cahill has been properly excellent in the premier league for the last few years and slotted in seamlessly at International level”

    Really? So why did no big club make a bid for him last summer? If you were right, he’d be a bargain at £17 million. Why did Fergie spend more than that on Jones if Cahill’s already everything United hope Jones will one day become?

    Cahill is not rubbish, but he’s not nearly world class either. You originally valued him at £7 million with just six months left on his contract – and that’s just ridiculous, because a player with six months left on their contract goes for 10-20% of their regular value, which means you value Cahill at £35-70 million. Bonkers.

    • I think you won the argument here even though I made that point to him before lol. No body is saying to him that Cahill is not good. Just that he was way over priced. Tottenham will over pay for players and even they did not close the deal.

  • Hahaha yes that’s exactly what I said, I rate Cahill as a £35-70m (wtf?) player. Nice conclusion you’ve leapt to there mate lmfao. I said £7m ish, it is a bit too much but Bolton will try and hold out for as much as possible as they did in the summer. Any less than that and they’d probably prefer to just keep him and let him go for free at the end of the season. If he helps them stay in the Premier league that’ll be worth a lot more than 5/6m to them.

    And on people not bidding for him… we bid for him you spoon. Chelsea were interested, City were interested, Spurs were interested big time. United chose Jones instead and that’s a fair choice, it’s a long term investment, Cahill is definitely better than him at the moment but in the future Jones will probably go on to be the better of the two.

    Also not sure the best way to explain this but when a player actually moves to your team, the length of time he previously had on his contract becomes completely meaningless. Take Jose Enrique for example. He was in the last year of his contract and Liverpool signed him for £7m. Now that he actually plays for Liverpool the fact he was in the last year of his contract is completely irrelevant. He’s a class player, Liverpool only paid £7m for him, bargain.

  • Pray tell me all these world class centre backs that Mertesacker has been fighting off for Germany, Shane.

    • None of the guys for England that you named are even world class. World class defenders right now in my book…. Matt Hummels, Thomas Vermaelen, Thiago Silva, Nemanja Vidic, Gerard Pique, Vincent Kompany. Unless I forgot a name then that is it. World class is used way to loosly. Now if we are talking about good center backs then for Germany you have guys like Badstuber, Boeteng, Howedes, Tasci, Friedrich, Wollschied, Westerman and of course Hummels. Only difference between that list and yours is that you only seem to watch the english league so those english players are “big names” to you.

  • I watch more Bundesliga than you mate. I watch probably as much Bundesliga as I do the premier league and some of the names you’ve just thrown out are completely laughable. Badstuber and Boateng are incredibly average. Badstuber is a left back really and only a makeshift centre back, and a very average one at that. Boateng is poor, he couldn’t even get a sniff at City behind Kompany and Lescott. Freidreich has never been above average/decent and is currently without a club which says it all really. Westermann is guff. Hummels is class and Howedes is a very good defender but certainly no better than Gary Cahill. Tasci is a talented defender who’s lost his way a little bit of late, probably about on par with someone like a Phil Jagielka. Wollshied is nothing special at all, what a bizarre name to pull out lol.

    • First off how would you know if you watch more bundes then me? Secondly, just because a player does not settle at one club does not mean he is not get. Didn’t Bayern dominate Man City? Badstuber is a center back naturally.

      The rest is just you being a moron and I will now avoid communicating with you any further. cheers mate

  • Haha. Lose an argument so result to petty insults. Classic Shane.

    • When you stop giving productive discussion then I don’t feel like wasting my time any more. If you feel that means you “win” then congrats.

  • Productive discussion? I just respond to all the points you make and when you don’t have an answer you just start insulting people. It’s pathetic. Just makes you seem like a tool. If you can’t discuss things like an adult then don’t bother.

  • But Adam, you didn’t make any points. The sum of your last post’s content can be summed up as ‘I disagree (rudely)’. You didn’t offer any reasons, just your opinion that some players are ‘guff’.

  • What more can I say? He listed a bunch of so called “quality” players and I gave my opinion on each. If you wanted me to go through every player individually and explain exactly why I rate them as I do I’d be here all day. Some players are just average or even downright poor. Not much more explanation is needed.

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